News - These ghoulish things
Posted on May 26, 2008
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| The portrait showed a part-human face, with the upper right quarter decomposing and an eyeball popping out of the socket. A devil’s tongue poked out of her mouth. Frankly, Picasso’s Guernica would have been a more romantic present.
A young child who saw the portrait being unveiled announced it looked like a corpse. He wasn’t far off the mark. Chapman thought it was hilarious - the comment and the portrait. “I was in shock but I found myself saying I loved it and in a way I do love it,” says Ms Brovig. “I love the idea and I love the story, even if it ended up as a rather expensive joke.” cool’ Some might think she got off lightly, one woman’s portrait reportedly showed a large penis balanced on a see-saw, while another depicted a seven-headed genitalia. They, like Ms Brovig, are probably wondering what to do with their picture when they finally get their hands on them. (From December until March 2007 the portraits will be on display at the Tate Liverpool in the Jake and Dinos Chapman: Bad Art for Bad People exhibition. “I don’t know what on earth to do with it,” says Ms Brovig. I don’t think I will have it on my wall, but I will get it out to show people. It will certainly be an interesting talking point at dinner parties.”
The couple hope the portrait might be a profitable investment. Turner Prize judge Andrew Renton says it will. “It might not make them millionaires but it is certainly money in the bank. Jake and Dinos Chapman are two of the most important and respected artists in Britain today and anything they do has value. “They couldn’t have done what they did with the portraits unless there was strong market for their art. It is very desirable and pieces have gone for millions of pounds. Paying 4,500 for the portrait is not a mistake and is a phenomenally cool wedding present.” It also made the artists some spare cash. Between them they painted two portraits an hour, eight hours a day for four days. That’s 288,000. ‘No Rembrandt’ Knowing what she now knows, Dea Brovig says she wouldn’t have Chapman do her portrait again. “Not that I can complain of any injustice, we knew exactly what chance we were taking when we signed up and we can hardly claim that we were expecting a Rembrandt,” she says. “While it may not be quite what we were hoping for, we’re still the lucky owners of a Jake Chapman painting. I keep reminding myself of my portrait’s one big redeeming feature. I am very pleased to note that there isn’t a single penis painted on or anywhere near my face. That, at least, is something.” Add your comments to this story, using the form below.
A fool and his money are easily parted - the buyers deserves all they got. As for the artist(?), why do we put up with pretentious rubbish like this? It’s not art and it never will be!!!
How ace! I love art and I love the Chapman brothers, they are total nutters. If I had one of these portraits done i’d so put it up on my wall, even if there was a giant penis in it. How amazing would it be? and such a talking point. I love the humour of their work and would be happy and proud to have it on my wall, especially if it was specially painted for me - how many average people can say they had a renowned artist paint their portrait?! Wack it up on your wall girl, what fun.
Trite, tasteless and talentless. i think their art is amazing. the depth and meaning. i also love their work ‘hell’ art needs more controvery and talent, as opposed to watercolour scenery and vases of flowers
New clothes Emperor? My 12 year old brother could do that.
I think these pictures have a real honesty about them, this is where art is going in the 21st Century and people have to let go of old school cliches. Some may find repulsive but I would definatly invest in them
I wish I’d have known. 4,500 for a one-off, personalised Chapman Brothers piece of artwork? It’s a steal, and no mistake. Art was never meant to be functional- you wouldn’t think him a fool who pays a brick of cash for a small pebble if was in fact a diamond, though that is all a diamond is… the same principle is at work in both situations. Okay, so it’s not my cup of tea, but you can’t say it’s not art. It’s creative and it gets people talking - what are we doing now? I like a bit of fun! Great investment, crap picture, sad world. Art is all about personal taste but too many artists are doing ‘modern’ pieces without having any real ability! I liked the picture, and I think it looked like Mrs.B. I don’t know what she was complaining about. Is it a surprise that the artist is actually laughing and smiling?? At 4,500 per painting I would be laughing too! What gives some the right to class whats art and what isn’t? what happened to being open minded and accepting other peoples tastes? This is teenage schoolroom art at its most middle-of-the-road “shock and offend” averageness. What sets it apart from the rest of the contemporary art of our time is that not only is its execution immature, but also its conceptualisation. I look forward to seeing how the art world justifies this. Even this web page is art, as artists have insisted that ‘art’ should not be constrained by definition. The point is that the painting is unattractive. Art? Sure, but unattractive, ugly and unpleasant to look at all the same. Original? Yes. But then, so is my dog’s dribbles. What a load of rubbish. GIve me a diamond ring any day! A portrait, huh? Nope, try as I might I just can’t see the resembalance. I’d get your bloke to ask for his money back, Miss Brovig; it looks like you’ve both been had. I totally agree with Robet Michell, Matt of Longon and Barry Scott Mackenzie. What will people think of us in a couple of hundred years when they see what we were calling art and were willing to pay money for it. I do like abstract art, but this has gone beyond the realms of that and I can imagine these kinds of “artists” laughing at us all the way to the bank. Ha Ha Ha. Bad art for Bad people looks like it’s going to be a cracking show. J&D have done it again. Thanks. Lucky chaps; they have hit on a particular ‘art’ formula which will make them rich celebrities: it’s just another batch of forgettable collages based on plagiarised horror motifs. None of this has anything to do with enriching or adding meaning to normal people’s lives. So, men find them rubbish, women find them fantastic - Interesting. Any psychologists out there to decipher this one? I would not have paid 4.50 and why it should take 30 mins is anyones guess. They’re having a laugh! This is fabulous. I’m so tired of ‘its not art’ comments - lazy cynisism and thoughtless accusations of pretension are exactly the things that make this work thrive. Wonderful. the chapman bros. are not original in the slightest.they are just attention seeking fools.art shouldn’t be about controversy. Martin - no he could not 4500 for that!!?? How about creating something with artistic merit rather than building your career on shock value. Amazing that people are willing to pay such an extraordinary amont to have themselves and their ignorance derided. I find it astonishing that the creators of this rubbish get away with it. good for their bank balance that they can, but it’s got no respect for self or others in it that I can fathom. “Shock art” is purile as it relies on nothing more subtle than its shock value to inspire its audience. The pretentious part is pretending that it is worth money. Art should be uplifting but, whilst it might or even should also challenge preconceptions and accepted views, I don’t relish the idea of “art” emanating from a clearly troubled mind and being accepted as “the way forward”. Pretencious crap dressed up as art. Another load of pollocks! Are you saying my bird is ugly mate? If you want a true representation, take a photo. If you want an of how someone else sees you - even just at that moment and only in their eye - let Jake paint you. To be honest, the less it looks like someone in particular the more saleable it will be. If you don’t like it because it doesn’t look like how you wanted it, sell it on for fifty grand, pocket the cash and take a holiday somewhere nice to recuperate. It’s art, not science. Barry Scott Mackenzie, I notice you use three names? Is this not pretentious? Well - I am really torn between condemning this non-art with the natural human envy of this girl getting a bloody good bargain for her money - who is to blame? The so called “off this planet” art critics who acclaim such dross or ourselves for buying it? Sick and revolting, and people call this art? “Hell” was one of the most impressive pieces of art I have ever seen. Shame it is no more. I think these two are taking the mickey out of all of us. Comtemporary art is sometimes interesting but often totally meaningless. What’s the point of that picture?? It certainly isn’t a potrait. It seems that ’shock and awe’ is the order the day for modern art. Despite all of that, those people will probably make a profit because some other mindless art buff with more money than sense will pay more for those pictures because they are painted by somebody called ‘Chapman’! Art is in the eye of the beholder. It doesn’t have penis on it because he has painted her face on a testicle. Brilliant I like it…it is different and unusual. For that is what Art is. It is different, it is always unusual. Painting is no longer merely about recording - for that we have photography. Art has to entertain - bear in mind that means occupying someones mind, be that because they like and enjoy the work or because they hate it. And while this may not be the most pleasant work to look at in the world, for a wedding present its a sound investment. I think Liz should stop wallowing in this self-indulgent artisitic drivel - ‘real honesty’ indeed - and get some english language lessons. It’s DEFINITELY not definatly Look beyond the shock factor and its actually quite a good likeness. “It’s not art and it never will be!!!” For those that want “pretty” take a picture of some flowers and enjoy yourself. Live with it. Label it art or label it insanity but, spend time on the work and not on your preconceptions, and, if you still get nothing from it, even disgust, then it’s not the work that’s impotent it’s you. Well considering what some “Antiques Roadshow” antiques are valued at, even if they are green and orange and covered in ceramic frogs, you can’t really judge what is worth money these days by it’s beauty. But didn’t someone once say similar things about Van Gogh, and Toulouse Lautrec, and Monet… I love the Chapmans work. The art world needs some more adventurous characters like them. I would definately hang it on my wall. Although I do feel for Ms Brovig, it is a pity that she isnt exactly thrilled with her wedding present! Barry Scott Mackenzie, art is in the eye of the beholder and not for any one person to decide what is and is not art… you don’t like it, who cares, it’s merely your opinion. Others do like it so leave them be. Martin, your 12 year old brother could have done that, but he didn’t - that is the difference between an artist and anyone else. Fascinating! I quite like it. Definitely a talking point and it wouldn’t go unnoticed like the general pieces on most walls. Whilst I can appreciate the more traditional, art is dependendant on individual creativity and this should be encouraged as unusual pieces like this challenge the traditional and demonstrate a creative open mind. That said, I don’t think I’d have a penis painting on my walls, but I love the wedding present! Emperors new Clothes summs the Chapman Brothers up. I have an appreciation for new and exciting art, but theirs is ‘Schoolboy & purile’, an excuse to draw phallic symbols, and try “shock” the world with naked child mannequins?. Tasteless tatt. To me they are quite boring !. Oh sigh … someone getting mercilessly rich again off the back of the snobs for whom it would seem expendable wealth and the of utter crap as “art” are directly proportional. My 38 year old brother could do that To me, art should convey some sort of emotion or message. What exactly does this convey? As for “humour in their work”, I’ve seen funnier scribbled on toilet walls and school desks.
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News - Walking through medical history
Posted on May 25, 2008
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But how many people passing through the area pause to take stock of its history - or indeed that of much of the city?
Would they know the area was once home to both the London Smallpox Hospital and the London Fever Hospital, which were bulldozed in 1848 to make way for the Great Northern Hotel?
Now Nick Black, professor of health services research at the London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine, is urging people to take time out to rediscover not only this area, but a large part of the capital’s medical history.
Seven walks
He has written a book detailing seven walks to existing and long-gone medical sites.
His aims are to how the capital’s health service developed the way it did and to help preserve a knowledge of its history.
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 Each walk helps to preserve London’s heritage as former health care buildings are increasingly converted into hotels, offices, homes and shops with public knowledge of their original function in danger of being lost  Nick Black
In Pictures: Medical walks
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Professor Black said the book, written and researched over three years, had been a joy to write.
“The more I dug around the more I discovered,” he said.
In the book, Walking London’s Medical History, Professor Black explains how events such as the Napoleonic wars were the catalysts for hospital services developing.
For instance, before 1800 eye diseases were mainly dealt with by unlicensed occultists, with the only specialist hospital - St John’s Hospital for Diseases of the Eyes, Legs and Breasts in Holborn - closing two years after its opening in 1771.
However, all this changed when many soldiers returned in 1803 from their campaigns against Napoleon in Egypt with serious eye .
This spurred the opening of three eye hospital - the Royal Infirmary for Diseases of the Eye, in Cork Street, in 1804, the London Dispensary for Curing Diseases of the Eye and Ear, in Charterhouse Square, in 1805 and, in 1816. the Infirmary for Diseases of the Eye, in St Giles.
Fistulas
The book also chronicles the history of the Fistula Infirmary, originally sited in Aldersgate Street, in 1835, where Lord Mayor of London William Copeland and Charles Dickens were treated for anal fistulas - a from an abscess.
By 1853 the infirmary had moved to City Road, where one of those to benefit from treatment was Jack the Ripper suspect, artist Walter Sickert.
“His treatment has been used as evidence that he suffered from an anal fistula and not, as those who believe he was Jack the Ripper have alleged, a penile fistula - which would have rendered him impotent and therefore, they claim, more likely to be a serial killer of women,” said Professor Black.
He added: “Each walk helps to preserve London’s heritage as former health care buildings are increasingly converted into hotels, offices, homes and shops with public knowledge of their original function in danger of being lost.”
His personal favourite is around the Soho area of the city - home to the city’s first hospital for women, the first ear, nose and throat hospital (the Royal Ear Hospital) and the first and most famous anatomy school (Great Windmill Street School).
Sexual liberalism
He said this area, which has always been home to London’s foreign population, suffered little bomb damage during WWII and, as a result, the street patterns have remained virtually unchanged for three centuries.
“It has always been quite bizarre. When you get there it is like a different world and it has always been a place for .”
He said this area had a strong part to play in the city’s sexual history.
“Soho is somewhere to take risks, to challenge orthodoxy.”
He said the consequences of this sexual liberalism were evident in its history - as it was home to London’s only specialist hospital for men with venereal disease, the London Lock Hospital, and the Hopital et Dispensaire Franais, which offered medical services to prostitutes.
There were also three hospitals in the area that openly offered treatment for venereal disease.
Author Peter Ackroyd, who has written the book’s foreword, says it chronicles London’s medical past from a time when it was so dirty and unhealthy that it was once known as a “vast hospital”, to the present day.
“The stories told along the route of this pilgrimage are of intense interest, reflecting as they do the continual battle against sickness and disease that engaged generation after generation of Londoners.”
The book, costing 14.95, is published by the Royal Society of Medicine Press.
And some information of .
News - Probation for indecent images man
Posted on May 23, 2008
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| A chartered surveyor caught with more than 1,000 indecent images of children has been placed on probation.
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Sport - First Test, day one as it happened
Posted on May 22, 2008
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1552: Ponting takes a quick single to Harmison at mid-off and the Durham man fumbles. Hoggard drops short and Hussey punches him away for three. Pietersen gets coated by the fans next to the boundary rope. Ponting brings up his 32nd Test ton with a whip through mid-wicket for three. It’s his ninth Test century in his last 13 Tests and his sixth versus England. Frightening. 277-3 1418: WICKET Australia 198-3 (Martyn 29) 1357: Harmison digs in a bouncer and it balloons well over Ponting’s head for a wide. Ponting brings up his 50 from just 65 balls with a push to mid-wicket. Better from Harmison, but you won’t see a more effortless half-century in your life as that from the Aussie skipper. 180-2 1259: WICKET Australia 141-2 (Langer 82) 1130: WICKET Australia 79-1 (Hayden 21) 1129: Fifty for Langer, only his second in Tests since last year’s Ashes. He’s delighted with that.
1002: Harmison bowls the first ball of this Ashes series - and it’s an absolute shocker, taken by Flintoff at second slip. Good grief…The second is little better, a couple of feet down Langer’s leg-side. The third raps Langer on the pad, and the next has Langer playing defensively. Harmison almost yorks Langer next up, but the nuggety Aussie opener, falling forward, whips it away for four. Langer then gets an outside edge that runs away for four. A ropey old first over from Harmison. 9-0
1644: Shadows lengthening at the Gabba as Pietersen continues with his twirlers. Hussey brings up his fifth Test fifty from his 94th ball faced. Rock solid. 317-3
1641: Giles is soldiering on, he’s been a little trooper. Mind you, so have I: I’ve written almost 6,000 words so far today. My dissertation wasn’t much longer than that. I made most of that up as I went along as well. If only I’d taken it more seriously, I might not be here having my spirit crushed. Three from Gilo’s over. 313-3
1637: Two from Pietersen’s over. 310-3
1633: Just one from Freddie’s over. Manful stuff Freddie, manful. People sending in poetry at 6.30 in the morning. Crackers, absolutely crackers. 308-3
“They have taken the Hill from the Gabba So the Barmies have nowhere to sing And Geoffrey is ‘tekin no pleasure’ At bowling no pace and no swing.
And nobody’s told poor old Harmi’ He’s supposed to be hitting the sticks Not trying to poleaxe poor Freddie - They’re not targets, you fool, they’re the slips!
And men now abed here in England Be thankful that you cannot see How Ponting is smashing poor Hoggard - Now Pietersen’s twisted his knee.
It’s five to six and it’s raining; The Aussies 280 for three; Now you tell me that Pietersen’s bowling That’s it - I give in - bed for me.”
Phillip Pritchard from Birmingham in the TMS inbox
1629: Pietersen beats Hussey with a wicked turner. He’s looking a bigger threat than Giles at the moment, but then so might my nan, and she’s been toes-up for 10 years. 307-3
1626: Flintoff is back on for his first spell after tea. Ponting goes walkabout in front of his stumps and Flintoff goes up for an optimistic lbw. Ponting then runs four from a leg-stump half-volley. 306-3
1621: Pietersen gets another one to turn away from Hussey. Still another 18 overs to bowl tonight, I’m going to be clobbering Auntie Beeb for some serious overtime. Ponting brings up Australia’s 300. 300-3
1618: Nothing looks like shifting Hussey. He’s like a ruddy limpet and Hoggard has rarely looked so impotent. 296-3
1614: There are a few heads down among the England fielders and they’re hanging on for dear life now. Pietersen gets a couple to bite and spin away from Hussey. Warne will be licking his chops, inbetween smoking fags. 293-3
1610: Ponting pushes Hoggard to mid-wicket, where Anderson fields well diving to his right. Australia will be nudging 400 by stumps. 289-3
“There are only two bowlers who will come off at the end of the day and think, ‘well, I couldn’t have done much more today’, and that’s Andrew Flintoff and Ashley Giles.”
Vic Marks, TMS summariser
1602: Pietersen is into the attack for a bit of gentle off-spin. He, like Bell, has one Test wicket to his name. Harmison is still missing in action somewhere, if that’s not a paradox. Decent enough over, three from it. Players take drinks.286-3
1559: Just one from Hoggard’s over. 283-3
1555: Hussey walks down the wicket and smashes Giles straight over his head for four. Giles gets his hand up and then thinks better of it and pulls it away. God I’m tired now, this is eye-watering stuff for the England faithful.282-3
1546: Hussey loves his scampered singles and gets Ponting back on strike and within one four of his ton. 270-3
1540: Ponting whips Hoggard through mid-wicket to move to 95. 266-3
“It’s just a flat pitch, a worker’s pitch, and you just have to strangle players out and not get downhearted. So if Australia get a score well over 450, it’s not the end of the world.”
Geoffrey Boycott, TMS summariser
1538: Hussey goes for a run and Flintoff, standing at short mid-wicket, shies at the stumps, but Hussey makes his ground. 262-3
1535: Bell is into the attack. Bizarre. His one Test wicket came at Faisalabad last winter. Ponting goes for a wide one and gets a thick outside edge for four before timing Bell through mid-on for another boundary. England need to root out another one here. 260-3
1529: Ponting brings up the fifty partnership off Giles. Good over from the England spinner though. 248-3
1523: England are shuffling their fielders around, perhaps trying to get under Ponting’s skin. Joyce is on for Hoggard at the moment. Anderson drops short and Hussey slams him over mid-wicket for four. 246-3
1522: Just two singles from Gilo’s over. He’s doing an honest, if decidedly unspectacular, job for England. 240-3
1518: Anderson beats Ponting outside the off-stump. That hasn’t happened too often today. Ponting plays a barbaric pull off the front foot for four. 238-3
1514: Giles has a big shout for lbw against Ponting turned down by umpire Bowden. The Barmy Army think the Aussie skipper has gone, as Bowden raises his arm to scratch his cheek at an extremely inopportune moment. Did he change his mind mid-raise? 232-3
1511: Just two from Anderson’s over, a plugging one from the Lancashire man. 231-3
1507: Hussey takes a quick single and Harmison could have run Ponting out with a direct hit. Pietersen is keeping us all guessing, he’s back on again. Bit of a drama queen our Kevin, maybe he just wants a bit of attention.229-3
1504: Players are back out and the good news for England is that Pietersen is with them. Ponting slams his front foot down the pitch and cracks Anderson straight for four. Ponting then rocks back and cuts the Lancashire seamer away for another boundary. Pietersen is off again, looking a little ginger. 226-3
“I’d be very surprised if two Australians didn’t get hundreds. The Kookaburra ball doesn’t do anything, which is why you need a good wrist spinner in your team. We’ve got two young ones at Yorkshire now, one of them will be in the England team in a few years time.” Geoffrey Boycott, TMS summariser
1439: The ‘King of Spain’ sticks one on a very un-regal length and Ponting gives it the hammer to move to 62. The umpires remove the bails and the players scoot off for some sticky buns and stuff, or whatever rubbish this mob eat nowadays. 217-3
1432: Pietersen tweaks his left knee fielding in the covers, and for a moment it looks like he’s done himself some serious mischief. The England physio is on and he shepherds Pietersen off the field. The good news for England fans is that it looks precautionary, he’s walking gingerly rather than hobbling about. 209-3
1430: Hussey uses his feet to Giles and whips him through mid-wicket for four. England are bouncing about in the field now, sensing that they’re in contention, if not on a par with Australia. 208-3
1423: Flintoff serves Hussey up some chin music. Welcome to Ashes cricket big man. Hussey then leaves one that almost sends his off-stump cartwheeling. Hussey then leans into one and the ball races to the long-on boundary. It’s 200-up for the hosts. 203-3
Gilo breaks through, Martyn making room and top-edging a dolly to Collingwood at slip. Collingwood looks to the manner born behind the stumps and England manage to nudge the door slightly ajar once more just as it looked like it was about to be jammed shut. Hussey survives the rest of the over.
“I keep hearing references to how late it is in the UK, things like ‘I’m sure you’re all stifling yawns’. The thing is, for myself and many other students, this sort of hour is when we’re most in our element. My sleeping patterns last week were ridiculous; usually I got to bed at about 9am and then woke up at 5pm…”
Ned Pendleton of Leamington Spa in the TMS inbox
1414: Flintoff is back on for his third spell, obviously mindful he’s the only one who’s looked like getting a wicket. Ponting picks up a couple to mid-wicket, but it’s another over of intent from Flintoff. It’s going to be a long, hot winter for the England skipper…198-2
1411: Ponting looks like he’s deliberately holding himself back against Giles, content just to nudge and nurdle - for now. 194-2
1409: Martyn paddles a short one from Harmison through the covers for two and follows up with a peachy drive for three to bring up the fifty partnership. 192-2
1406: Maiden over from Gilo - Ponting surprisingly watchful at the moment. 187-2
1404: Another maiden from Harmison, but he’s hardly giving the Australian batsman any problems. 187-2
“Gilo’s lost an awful lot of weight, I think he’s on the Cambridge diet, the one that Botham sometimes goes on. He is a different shape. Blowers would struggle to call him a wheelie bin at the moment.”
Jonathan Agnew, TMS commentator
1358: Time for the King of Spain to strut his stuff. Martyn takes an early liking, sauntering down the wicket and lofting him over mid-on for four. Dreamy late cut by Martyn and Strauss just stops the four at third man. 187-2
1351: Bit airy-fairy that by Martyn, driving away from his body straight to Pietersen at point. He gets three with a similar shot next ball. 177-2
1345: Ponting tucks Harmison, slipping down the leg-side, away for one. Harmison looks to have found some rhythm at long last, like a train which was bouncing along the tracks suddenly slipping into a groove. 171-2
“It’s slightly dispiriting that a Harmison maiden over should elicit such euphoria among his team-mates…”
Vic Marks, TMS summariser
1342: One from Hoggy’s over and the big, weird drink car crashes over the boundary and the players take on energy. 169-2
“Ponting is seeing the ball like a big Queensland mango at the moment. Although there are good signs from England, they’re showing a bit of resolve.”
Tim Lane, TMS commentator
1334: Harmison bowls possibly his first decent delivery of the day, getting Martyn to fence outside outside off-stump. MAIDEN OVER FROM HARMISON, ATTENTION, MAIDEN OVER FROM HARMISON. 168-2
1329: Hoggard, still striving for some swing, is wheeled back into the attack. Can he be the man to put his hand up for England? Martyn tucks Hoggard away for three, Harmison sticking out a big clown’s boot on the fine-leg boundary. Ponting then rocks back to a long-hop and pulls the ball to the boundary. The Aussie skipper’s in some nick. 168-2
1328: Harmison is back into the attack. This is pretty much crunch time for him. His second ball, short outside off-stump, is given the full welly by Martyn. The rest of the over is better though, just one from it. 160-2
1322: The Barmy Army go up for a crowd catch, Ponting cracking the ball into the ground and Pietersen pulling the ball in at backward point. Ponting then flicks the ball away and a Hoggard mis-field allows the boundary. Thought he’d done himself a mishief there, a la Simon Jones. Martyn gets off the mark with a square-cut for three to bring up Australia’s 150. Anderson then plops one short and Ponting drags him to the mid-wicket boundary. Pressure released for the hosts. 155-2
1317: Harmison is off the field, replaced by Plunkett. Not sure what, if anything, the problem is. Flintoff is not letting Martyn get off the mark easily - another maiden. 143-2
“The sooner they crack the secret of human cloning and we can have 11 Freddies the better…”
Rob Dipper from Manchester in the TMS inbox
1310: Anderson slices Ponting in half with one that jags back, but it misses everything. Just two from the over - Anderson’s doing his bit. 143-2
1308: Martyn still not off the mark, Flintoff building a bit of pressure up. Geoffrey Boycott reckons he’s vulnerable to a bit of short stuff. Where’s Harmison…? 141-2
“Very elegant player Martyn, he scores runs without you even noticing. He’s had a public fall-out with Dennis Lillee by the way, he says he’s lost all respect for him…”
Jonathan Agnew, TMS commentator
1303: A maiden from Anderson, keeping Ponting honest for an over at least. 141-2
Flintoff’s done it again, Langer driving straight to Pietersen at cover-point. Pietersen’s first Ashes catch after six spillages in 2005. That’s a gimme for England and the tourists are clinging on. Martyn is next batsman, and he defends the first ball comfortably.
1256: Flintoff has Langer nibbling at one and Ponting is almost caught in the gully, but the ball evades a sprawling Giles. Freddie gives Ponting a few verbals.
1255: Umpire Bowden has another look at the ball before tossing it back to Anderson. Not sure what’s wrong with it - we’re not in for another dose of Hair-Gate? Security have confiscated a giant, green and gold beach ball - not the most dangerous of weapons. I had a knife pulled on me at Headingley once - no one bothered confiscating that off the bloke at the gate. Langer plays a glorious cover-drive off Anderson for four before Ponting times the ball through mid-wicket for another boundary. 135-1
1246: Ponting plays a false stroke off Flintoff, getting a thickish outside edge which is well stopped by Gilo in the gully. Stroke of the day from Ponting, driving Flintoff to the long-on boundary. The Aussie skipper looks in ominous form, he’s already seeing it like a beach ball. 124-1
1240: Players are back out after lunch and Anderson will have first go with the ball. Langer gets his first boundary after the restart, carving Anderson to the backward point boundary and follows up with a cover-drive for four. Round the wicket chaps? It worked back in Blighty. 118-1
“I thought Harmison should have bowled in Adelaide, it seemed strange to me. He should have bowled, and if he broke down, so be it, because he’s not worth his place in the side…”
Jonathan Agnew, TMS commentator
“Against South Australia, I heard Darren Lehmann got one from Panesar first up and thought ‘geez, this is going to be . But Panesar then proceeded to bowl rather flat, so he didn’t take his chance.”
Former Australian fast bowler Damien Fleming on TMS
Send your emails to TMS@bbc.co.uk
“I take the point of Hoggard having to bat at number 8 if Panesar plays, BUT if the top seven batsmen in the team can’t perform then I believe one more batsman won’t make much difference.”
James Hall in the TMS inbox
1202: Gilo is on to bowl his first Test over since last November. Can he get some success just before lunch? Ponting defends the first three balls and sweeps the fourth for a single. Just one from the over and it’s round one to Australia. I’m off for a spot of tea, but don’t go away…109-1
1157: Hoggard back on from the Vulture Street end. Langer runs his first ball away for four through gully to bring up Australia’s 100. The next ball is tickled down to fine-leg for another boundary. Hoggard clutches his head after the next ball, which he expected to nip back and clean Langer up. Ten from the over, England need another one and fast. 108-1
1152: Langer attempts an expansive drive off Flintoff - unconvincing. The England skipper has been by far the best bowler so far, but he’ll have to give himself a breather soon. One from the over. 98-1
“Thanks to your wonderful coverage, I am providing updates for my friends at Eastbourne Uni. Your coverage is also stopping me going mad from writing an article about the history of Fiorentina Football Club…”
Oliver Jones in the TMS inbox
1147: Langer plays a dreadful attempted drive off Harmison, whips his helmet off and gives himself a ticking off. Ponting gets off the mark with a majestic pull for four which almost decapitates umpire Bucknor and follows up with a dreamy back-foot drive to the extra-cover boundary. 97-1
1143: Langer gets a brute from Flintoff, who gets one to spit off a length. The England skipper’s got his dander up, and, my God, England need him to. Langer’s developed a funny old leave, twirling his wrists as the ball passes by. 86-1
1138: Langer latches on to a shortish one from Harmison and runs three. Ponting on strike. Better from Harmison, who’s nudging 90mph on the speedo, and then breaks through the magic mark. 82-1
Flintoff makes the breakthrough, Hayden edging him to Collingwood at second slip. Flintoff goes ruddy beserk - at least he’s up for it. Skipper Ponting strides to the middle. He looks more and more like George W Bush this boy. Ponting survives the over.
1128: Over-pitched from Harmison and Langer piles into it for a few. Langer almost plays on attempting a cut and thinks he’s got his 50 next ball, but it’s a leg-bye. 78-0
1124: Come on Freddie, time for a bit of the old Superman act. Not much singing at the Gabba, certainly not from the Barmy Army, just contented chatter. The Aussie openers look well and truly dug in. Two from the over. 73-0
Email us at TMS@bbc.co.uk - Aggers and Vic Marks will be answering your posers during the lunch break
1118: Harmison is back on, to applause from both Aussie and England fans. Flintoff has removed himself - he’ll probably have a dart from the other end. Hayden drags Harmison’s first ball away for a couple. Harmison’s second ball is two feet outside off-stump and the Durham man is drawing some boos now. Whether from the Aussie or England fans, it’s unclear. 71-0
1113: Langer laces a full-length Anderson delivery through the covers for four and the Queensland crowd purr in admiration. Anderson tries out a bouncer and umpire Bucknor signals wide. Harmison’s stretching up, looks like he’ll take next over. 68-0
“What the hell is Harmison doing out there? He hasn’t bowled well for two years, I think we all have to realize he’s finished. Stuart Broad should be taken out of the Academy right now.”
Rob Chard in the TMS inbox
1107: Flintoff slings one down the leg-side, Jones gets a glove to it, but it’s three leg-byes. Langer picks up three runs to gully. 63-0
“What’s happening with the England backroom staff? Why is Harmison still bowling rubbish?”
Geoffrey Boycott, TMS summariser
1103: Langer plays an unconvincing cut shot which dribbles to gully before almost nibbling on an Anderson delivery. A maiden and players rush for drinks. It has, without any shadow of a doubt, been Australia’s opening hour. 57-0
1058: It’s Freddie time, probably earlier than he would have wanted. His first ball is tucked away by Hayden and Anderson misses with a wild shie at the stumps as the Aussie batsmen scamper a single. Flintoff immediately settles in round the wicket to the left-handers and Cook is installed at short leg. Flintoff bounces Langer and the ball is hooked away for a single. Probing stuff from Flintoff. 57-0
1048: Anderson drops short and Langer brings up Australia’s 50 with a murderous cut. Anderson tests Langer with a bumper which the batsman bounces clear of. Langer, of course, has not played in Tests since being hit on the head by South Africa’s Makhaya Ntini in April. 51-0
1045: Hayden plays another sketchy drive and the ball flies over gully for another boundary. England aren’t having much luck here in all fairness. Langer throws the kitchen sink at the last ball of the over, but the ball is pulled up just short of the boundary. Langer gets three. 47-0
1040: It’s all calmed down a bit at the Gabba thanks to some on-the-money stuff from Hoggard and Anderson. Anderson in particular is getting some decent lift. Australia’s early onslaught seems to have been premeditated, and it worked, in that they’ve carted Harmison out of the attack. 40-0
1037: Hoggard gets one to spit off the wicket like fat from a frying pan, but Langer just pulls his bat out of the way. A maiden from Hoggard, dependable as ever. 40-0
1033: Anderson bowls a pretty good over apart from the last ball, which Langer drags away for a few. 40-0
1029: Flintoff has lobbed the ball to umpire Bowden - he clearly thinks there’s something wrong with it. But umpire Bucknor has a look and tells England to get on with it.
1026: A little bit depressing this. Hoggard slings one down the leg-side and Hayden drags him round the corner for three. Hayden throws his bat at a wide one and the ball just eludes a diving Bell at gully. 37-0
“England look tentative and on edge and you’re already starting to think, when’s Freddie going to bring himself on?”
Vic Marks, TMS summariser
1019: Flintoff has pulled Harmison after just two overs. Round one Aussies? Anderson of Lancashire is into the attack and his first ball, pretty much a long-hop, is yanked for four by Langer. Langer plays another pull off Anderson, but only gets three for it. Pugnacious as ever, he’s throwing his bat at everything. Anderson strays on to Hayden’s pads (a bad place to stray) and the big man flicks him away for three. A chastening start for England.
“At 19 years old, it is a strange thought that, with my bottle of Holden’s Golden Glow, TMS on the wireless and the newspaper in front of me, I have become my father. So much for student life!”
Tom Slater in the TMS inbox
1018: Hayden sticks a big size 12 down the pitch and creams Hoggard through mid-off for four. A decent enough over from Hoggard, but there’s no swing, and that’s a bad sign. 21-0
1011: Langer slices a drive and the ball beats Giles at gully and runs away for four. Sketchy. Langer is hit on the pad, but there’s only a strangled lbw appeal from Harmison. Langer then carves Harmison away for another four. 17-0
1007: Yorkshire’s Hoggard gets next go with the ball. Will it swing for him? It has to. His first ball is left by Hayden outside off-stump. Hayden plays a fine off-drive and Pietersen makes a good diving stop. Hoggard then has Hayden playing an ugly drive and almost gets a . Interesting. A maiden. 9-0
1000: Hayden and Langer take to the field to rapturous applause. You might say the Aussie fans are up for this - it’s more like a Premiership football match.
0958: England have won just four of 17 Tests at the Gabba - the last on the 86/87 tour. England take to the field and fall into a familiar huddle. The old butterflies are fluttering now…
“Aggers, have you ever taken your laptop to bed instead of your Emma?”
Geoffrey Boycott, TMS summariser
“Jones is under a lot of pressure. He can’t afford to drop Hayden or Ponting on nought - it’ll all go downhill from there…”
Phil Tufnell, Radio Five Live
0951: God Save the Queen is sung by a delightful, raven-haired Aussie and gets maximum respect from the Gabba crowd. A phalanx of female singers is wheeled out for the Aussie anthem. There’s something very military about all this.
0946: Time for the national anthems. Geez, these s are a patriotic lot. Former wicket-keeper Ian Healy, a Queenslander, and English legend Ian Botham, carry the flags to the middle.
0945: Who’s going to open the bowling for England? Anderson could get a bit of swing early on, and maybe he’ll take the new ball with Harmison.
0943: I hear Harmison’s parents, girlfriend and a few buddies are out in Brisbane with him, so he should be in good fooling anyway.
0940: The last time Australia batted first at the Gabba four years ago, it was the preface to one of the most depressing five or six hours of my life. Simon Jones busted a knee and Australia had pretty much won the game by stumps. Come on Harmy, stick it up ‘em son.
“The first hour it might nip around so we’re not too dejected. The first 10 overs we’ve got to get it in the right area. We don’t take gambles at this stage. Ashley’s prepared well and bowled a lot of overs in the nets.”
England skipper Andrew Flintoff
0932: Australia skipper Ricky Ponting chooses tails at the toss, wins it and chooses to have a bat. We’ll learn sooner rather than later whether Duncan Fletcher has made a blunder in including Gilo over Panesar.
0927: Stuart Clark is given the nod over Mitchell Johnson in Australia’s starting Xl. Less pace than Johnson, but Clark took a stack of wickets in South Africa - 20 in three Tests at 15.85.
0918: It’s bubbling up nicely at the Gabba, the Barmy Army getting in some early sparring with the locals. Not many of you agree with Giles’ inclusion. I’m getting excited now - got myself strapped in for the next nine hours.
“Do you really want Hoggard coming out at number eight with England on 260-6? Giles is not Don Bradman, but he is more than capable of hanging around in that situation, as he did on a couple of notable occasions last year.”
Jonathan Agnew, TMS commentator
“By chance, I was walking through the maze of rival packs of fans when the England team bus reversed into its garage in the bowels of the Gabba.
Alastair Cook was white with nerves, and there weren’t any smiles or waves. Freddie was the only relaxed member of the team, standing at the front chatting away. In the ground, I can see about 10 St George Cross flags already. As is tradition, the names of local towns are inscribed in black ink.
Freddie’s Preston mob are here in force, there’s some Durham support and more from Weymouth on the south coast.”
Oliver Brett, BBC Sport in Brisbane
0912: No word yet on the Australia team, but we’re not expecting any surprises. It’s quite possible they can’t speak yet as they’re all doubled up laughing on hearing of Giles’ inclusion.
“Panesar left out! Fletcher needs to resign. We must pick the best specialist players!”
Pete Herridge, Bristol, in the TMS inbox
0905: Bell is to bat at three for England, with Pietersen coming in at four. Collingwood tucks in at five, just ahead of skipper Flintoff.
0902: Has England coach Duncan Fletcher blinked before a ball has even been bowled? As predicted, Giles, who hasn’t played a Test for over a year, has been included instead of Panesar. Giles has bowled only 31 competitive overs on this tour. Ideal preparation for an Ashes battle?
0900: England name their starting XI for the first Test in Brisbane - and Ashley Giles has got the nod over Monty Panesar:
England Xl: Strauss, Cook, Bell, Pietersen, Collingwood, Flintoff (capt), Jones, Giles, Harmison, Anderson, Hoggard
News - African children ‘at risk of ritual abuse’
Posted on May 21, 2008
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Considered “conduits of God” by some, they claim to be able help return a loved one, cure impotency and , help advance your career and even make you wealthy.
One such says he can cast away “evil influences and bad luck”, another will break voodoo and black magic curses and several others offer exorcisms.
Concern has been growing about the impact on children of such ritual practices.
The issue hit the headlines with the grim discovery of a torso of a young boy in the Thames in September 2001.
Police believe the child, later named Adam, had been the victim of a west African-style ritual sacrifice.
How widespread is the problem? Academics estimate only 5% of crimes involving possession or witchcraft are actually reported.
Africans Unite Against Child Abuse (Afruca), a UK charity, is calling for tighter regulation of minority churches and faith s.
“Anybody can just come over and open a church and they don’t have to show they’re complying with child protection guidelines,” said Afruca spokesman Million Joseph.
“We are concerned with some pastors who are not accountable to anybody and who have the means to manipulate their followers into believing their child is possessed.”
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These pastors are seen as conduits of God and they have enormous authority and control over church members Amma Anane-Agyel
Tower Hamlets |
Kingston Racial Equality Council (KREC), a voluntary organisation in south-west London, is undertaking research on the potential for child abuse in African evangelical churches.
“With issues such as demonic possession, you have to consider the impact of exorcism on a child both physically and mentally,” said John Azah, KREC director.
“If you take a child to a church and force him or her to drink what is claimed to be holy water and physically beat the devil out of them - that’s child abuse.”
Mr Azah went undercover to approach an African pastor in the East End a few years ago, claiming his niece was possessed.
“His church was basically his living room,” he said. “He claimed he could cure both of us with a potion which would cost 700.”
The project, covering Kingston and Croydon, aims to identify these churches and work with them and social services to protect children.
“The aim of this project, which we hope will eventually be rolled out across London, is to find out how widespread ritual child abuse is and put systems in place to address it,” he said.
‘Conduits of God’
A BBC Newsnight investigation in February 2005 suggested only a third of London’s local authorities were taking the issue seriously.
Since then, Tower Hamlets in east London has identified 60 churches in the borough where exorcisms might take place.
Adam is believed to have been brought to the UK for a ritual killing
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“These pastors are seen as conduits of God and they have enormous authority and control over church members,” said Amma Anane-Agyel, of the council’s social services department.
“Our concern is that practices like exorcism may be harmful to the child, not just physically but emotionally as well, and affect their whole wellbeing,” she said.
Ms Anane-Agyel manages the council’s African family services which has set up a pastors’ group bringing together church leaders and council representatives to discuss ritual practices.
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We do not police the inside of people’s homes and are increasingly reliant on vigilance within the community Det Ch Supt Peter Spindler
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“Rather than people’s beliefs, we focus on the harm acts like exorcisms will have on the child.
“This approach is usually much more effective in persuading people not to resort to such practices.”
However, the African Caribbean Evangelical Alliance, a non-regulatory body with 3,000 members, said exorcism was not inherently bad.
“If it’s done biblically and children and adults are not harmed, then exorcisms are fine,” said spokesman Katie Kirby.
In the past five years, 32 cases of crimes involving possession or witchcraft were in London out of 40 nationally, according to the Department for Education and Skills.
Det Ch Supt Peter Spindler, head of the Metropolitan Police’s child abuse investigation unit, said academics estimate only 5% of the actual abuse taking place is reported.
Speaking at a child abuse conference in London in July, he said: “We do not police the inside of people’s homes and are increasingly reliant on vigilance within the community.”
News - ‘Viagra cocktail’ takes off in Sao Tome
Posted on May 20, 2008
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| A cafe on the island of Sao Tome off Africa’s west coast relies on its famed aphrodisiac cocktail to pull in punters during the festive season.
A large glass bottle containing a brown liquid labelled “Pilolo Atomico” - which means Atomic Penis - occupies a prime position on the bar. “It’s so popular, even the talks about it,” says Maria-Joao Pombo, the owner of Cafe and Companhia (Cafe and Company). “Pilolo Atomico is made up of a mixture of a local brandy and several tree barks,” she says. “We also flavour it with things like cinnamon because it is very bitter. Here in Sao Tome, they say it’s an aphrodisiac.” Herbal remedy Ms Pombo, who moved to the island five years ago, has been selling the cocktail for about a year and a half.
She decided to go commercial after hearing about the local erotic concoction. “I knew people here eat the bark of plants like Pao tree; washing it down with what they call a ‘hot (alcoholic) drink’. “So I decided to combine the ingredients and bottle it,” she says.
Traditionally, however, the drink was not only used to enhance sexual potency. People ate the tree bark to cure stomach pains and hernias. It also gave them the strength to walk for miles without food or drink. Sceptics And Pilolo Atomico is not its original name either, this was cooked up by some of Ms Pombo’s friends while sitting at the bar.
“I knew the name sounded very suggestive but I didn’t know exactly what “pilolo” meant,” she explains. “Once the drink started becoming more popular, I decided to register the name and the product. “But they wouldn’t let me. That is when I found out that “pilolo” means penis.” Sceptics say the popularity is just down to its name, but some cafe regulars swear by it.
“When I drink just one glass of pilolo, I feel strong for 12 hours. Believe me, it really does work,” says Miguel. “You just have to make sure you have a beautiful woman with you,” he adds. Women also seemed to appreciate its aphrodisiacal effects. “It’s fantastic, much better than the blue pill,” says Alexia, referring to the impotency drug Viagra. Others say the cocktail is an acquired taste. “It tastes foul,” says Bibi. But effective or not, safe sex is the message - every Pilolo Atomico comes with a free condom.
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News - The world this week
Posted on May 19, 2008
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Bali decision: An Indonesian court hears an appeal by three of the 2002 Bali night club bombers against their death sentences. Lawyers for Amrozi, Mukhlas and Imam Samudra argue they were convicted on the basis of retroactive legislation.
Bomb trials timeline
Mengistu sentence: Sentence is passed on Ethiopia’s Marxist ex-ruler, Mengistu Haile Mariam, after his conviction in absentia for genocide. He has been in exile in Zimbabwe since being ousted in 1991 and many fear he will never face justice.
Mengistu profile
Tube bomb trial: Six men go on trial in London accused of attempting to bomb the city’s transport system on 21 July 2005. Five long years: Guantanamo marks its fifth anniversary as America’s controversial high-security detention centre in Cuba for terror suspects. US peace activists plan a march up to the centre’s gates.
Guantanamo quick guide
Hitler the comedy: A taboo-breaking comedy depicting the Nazi dictator as an impotent, bed-wetting drug addict, who plays with a in his bath, premieres in Germany. “I know I am dancing on mass graves…” its Swiss-Jewish director Dani Levy says, arguing that laughter is “liberating”. FRIDAY 12 JANUARY
Drug rap: US rapper Snoop Dogg appears in court in Los Angeles on weapons and drugs charges. SATURDAY 13 JANUARY
Mid-East talks: US Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice visits Cairo in another bid to the Middle East peace process. SUNDAY 14 JANUARY
French candidate: The ruling party Union for a Popular Movement is expected to announce that interior minister Nicolas Sarkozy will be its candidate for the 22 April election. Here’s looking at you: Fifty years since the death of Hollywood screen legend Humphrey Bogart, star of Casablanca and gangster films.
Casablanca script voted all-time best
This guide to the week ahead is not intended as an exhaustive list, and the events noted may be cancelled or postponed.
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News - Germans learn to laugh at Hitler
Posted on May 18, 2008
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| In the city centre, rowdy photographers crowd round a man who is doing the kind of impressions you don’t usually see here done in public.
He has put one finger under his nose like a fascist moustache, and has one leg raised in the air as if he is about to goose-step down the street. This is not some kind of illegal neo-Nazi - it’s the red carpet at a film premiere. In the cinema behind, they are about to show Germany’s first ever mainstream comedy about Adolf Hitler. The film, Mein Fuehrer - the Truly Truest Truth about Adolf Hitler, shows a dramatically different image of the Nazi leader from the one Germans are used to seeing at their cinemas. ‘Bumbling buffoon’ In one scene, Hitler, played by a top German comedian, is splashing about in the bath with his toy battleship.
When he is told there is a plot to kill him, he sinks under the suds. This Hitler is a manic depressive, who is sexually impotent and wets his bed. He is reduced to a bumbling buffoon. The film is written and directed by Swiss-born Jewish director Dani Levy. “Making comedies about hateful people is weird! Usually you’re making comedies about people you really love,” he told the BBC. “As a Jewish person who’s been living in Berlin more than 25 years, I felt I needed a new approach, and create a comedy to deconstruct the Nazi figures, to have a better understanding of what made German people follow Adolf Hitler.” Collective guilt More than 60 years after his death, Adolf Hitler’s murderous rule still feeds a sense of collective guilt, and collective responsibility in Germany.
But Germans are learning to laugh out loud about some aspects of the Nazi regime. Last year Rudolph Herzog published a collection of Hitler jokes. “In the 1960s, the younger generation - the sons and daughters of the perpetrators - were asking hard questions,” Rudolph says, “and making jokes about the subject would have been totally in their eyes. “Now there’s a new generation and I guess we have a more distant view. Without neglecting the horrors of what happened we can also see the ridiculousness of the top brass in this regime”.
Back in the film, the crazy Fuehrer is in a flap. Too depressed to give his big speech to the people, he demands that a former acting coach, who is Jewish, be brought in to help boost his confidence. In this picture, Adolf Hitler comes across as a sick, weak individual, used by those around him. Film critic Knut Elstermann believes that is a big mistake. “As a viewer of that movie, I see Hitler as a child,” Knut told me. “He had a horrible childhood, so he is traumatised and I feel some pity for him. He is surrounded by horrifying creatures, like Goebbels and Goering, everyone is using him like a puppet. “This is something I find quite dangerous, because Hitler is responsible for everything that happened in Germany, and especially the Holocaust.” As Mein Fuehrer hits cinema screens across Germany, what is interesting is that the debate here is no longer about whether it is right or wrong to laugh about Hitler. Even local Jewish groups have said they have nothing against making fun of the Nazis. The question is what kind of jokes and what kind of humour are , and - ultimately - whether the film is good or bad. And that’s a sign that Germany is slowly moving on, out of the shadows of its Nazi past.
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News - Europe diary: Denying war crimes
Posted on May 17, 2008
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| Historian David Irving now thinks he might have been wrong about the Holocaust, but told me: “Germany… is trying to dictate terms but it’s really a political tactic. It’s what Germans call a Persilschein, which is a Persil certificate to prove that they are thinking decently now.
“And they can’t do that at the expense of the other European nations and they can’t do that at the expense of free speech. I will be the first person in this country to go out into the street and try to break the law. Because I think it’s a silly law and silly laws need to be exposed as such.” A NEW SET OF CIRCUMSTANCES
Most Jewish in the UK don’t want a new law. A panel of lawyers and distinguished experts, which looked into the question of introducing a holocaust-denial law in the UK in 1999 agreed with the government line that what we had was enough. But now the man who chaired the panel, the lawyer Anthony Julius, has had second thoughts.
“Times have changed. At that time Holocaust denial was the plaything of cranks, impotent cranks. People who could represent no real threats to Jews or others,” he tells me. He goes on: “Since then, the president of Iran has made a series of potentially lethal interventions into global political life, both sponsoring Holocaust-denial and calling for the destruction of the state of Israel. Now that combination creates an entirely new set of circumstances - meaning that the German proposal should be taken very seriously. “The legal tradition in this country has been very heavily biased in favour of free speech, and that is a good thing, but I think that we need to recognise the changed political circumstances and give much more consideration to the German proposal than we might otherwise be inclined to.” It’s the European Commission’s third bash at getting some sort of law on racism on the books and it’s been weakened along the way, dropping for instance, plans to outlaw the swastika everywhere in the EU. There are doubtless pros and cons of having what amounts to a Europe-wide law, but what is the point of having such laws that member states can ignore? BABY LAW
“So it’s a law now is it?” This innocent question from a colleague in London as I prepared a piece on the European Commission’s plans for a legal curb on CO2 emissions from cars made me think it might be a good idea to follow in detail how something becomes an EU law - as I promised last week. I hope it will be enlightening to follow the life cycle of a law.
The commission’s proposal is a law to ensure that by 2012 the average car sold in Europe emits no more than 130g of CO2 kilometre driven. We’ve seen the baby law get to its wobbling feet and now we’ll track its progress as it makes its perilous way through the Brussels jungle. The first to look over this frail beast were the desk officers within the embassies of the 27 EU countries, in Brussels. After this there was a discussion in the regular meeting of Coreper. Who? Oh, the 27 ambassadors to the EU, or their deputies, that’s Coreper: Comit des reprsentants permanents. (In this hunt you will also learn some Brussels acronyms which may come in useful in Scrabble.) The first full-blown political discussion will be at the meeting of environment ministers on 20 February. The Germans, who are in the chair, want to ask two fundamental questions. Indeed, they go to the very guts of the existence of this law. They are: “Should there be binding legislation on car manufacturers?” and “Is the level of 130g of carbon for every kilometre driven, the right one?” If the ministers answer “No”, then it’s game over. But I very much doubt they will (find out next week) although they might offer up some changes for form’s sake. GLOOMY ENVIRONMENTALISTS
Then there will probably be lot of discussions in European foreign ministries but little public action until the Spring Council, the meeting in March of Prime Ministers and Presidents. Watch the Germans, Angela Merkel says they will not make the “error” of thinking only of narrow national interests, even though changing the way cars are produced “won’t be easy” for Germany. But will she really not give an inch to the powerful German motor industry?
By the end of the year our little “Communication” may have evolved into a full-blown draft “Directive”. All it then has to brave is two or three years’ more debate, starting with the European Parliament. A pessimistic environmental pressure group that I talked to reckons it may not be passed until 2010, two years before it has to come into effect. It gloomily predicts car manufacturers will argue this leaves them little time to implement it, and argue for a delay. Your comments:
I believe that the Holocaust did occur. However, it does seem ironic to me that the courts will turn down requests to ban political parties with paedophile agendas - as was recently the case in the Netherlands - on the grounds of Freedom of Speech and yet peoples right to deny historical events, even if they are based on misinformed information, seems to takes precedence. It seems to me that Society has its priorities all mixed up we should be focussing our energies on protecting our children! I’m a Jew, with no family left in Europe after the war. A law restricting free speech is *wrong*. The best way to fight lies is with facts and truth. Let the deniers speak, and be there to correct them and call their lies as they are.
My grandather was in the ground troops that liberated Bergen-Belsen camp so he saw what the Nazi’s did. Holocaust denial offends me personally from the point of having Jewish ancestry. However to criminalise this would probably give those with these stupid uneducated views the opportunity to use arguments of free speech to support their ridiculous cause. Let them have their rants. It is their right just as much as it is mine to decry their ignorance.
Your analysis reduces the german proposition in two ways. First, it is worth noting that the first part of the two-part draft deals with “Public incitement to hatred and violence for reasons of racism or xenophobia…” And only in this context the cited of “conduct that is apt to disturb the public peace” is mentioned. (Press release “Outlawing Racism and Xenophobia Throughout Europe”, German Ministry of Justice, Jan 29th 2007) Second, and that has consequences for a number of commentaries published here, the definition of genocide is further qualified: “The Framework Decision…refers to the Statute of the International Criminal Court and the International Military Tribunal of 1945…Whether a concrete historic crime falls within these definitions would be decided by a court in each concrete and specific case.” (Same source) You quote D.Irving: “Germany… is trying to dictate terms but it’s really a political tactic. It’s what Germans call a Persilschein, which is a Persil certificate to prove that they are thinking decently now.” Is there any further prove needed that this man has a mental problem? There are some 80 Mio. Germans. Are they all thinking the same way? Even under the Nazis, only 10% of the population were party members. Some 600.000 Germans fled the country, and the first and the last victims of the Nazis were Germans. It is comfortable to put entire nations into a box, but it doesn’t bring us closer to the truth. What would you say if I claimed that all British men wear women’s underwear just because some are known to do so? The most worrying aspect is how Germany wants to impose this law. One can understand that the Germans need such a law because the Holocaust is uniquely tied up with their history. So for a German to deny the Holocaust means something very different from an Englishman (or an Iranian for that matter) who does the same thing. One can’t help wondering if this is more about “guilt fatigue” on Germany’s part. As for Bosnia, in 2005 officials from the Hague Tribunal published a paper estimating that 102,000 people died, on all sides. But one still sees 200,000 or 250,000 quoted, figures whose provenance the paper revealed are not based on rigorously checked data. Would this paper have been published if the proposed law had been in place? The question of why a scientific figure is ignored is the flip side of “genocide denial” - should it be called “genocide inflation” - which can equally result in hate mongering against the “baddies”, in that case the Serbs.
I think the law is absurd. At no point should thought be legislated. I personally find it incomprehensible that someone could deny one of the greatest tragedies in modern history. However, if denial or refusal to believe is made illegal we are surrendering tremendous power to the state; the power to tell us what to believe or disbelieve. I think we all know that once power is surrendered it is rarely, if ever, retrievable. In my mind this is one very scary step towards state thought control. We should never allow the state to tell anyone what to believe or disbelive. Truthfully, we all know that these laws will not change anyone’s mind on the subject. It will only make it illegal for them to speak their mind.
It won’t be long before there’s criminalization of climate change denial!
Freedom of speech IS the freedom to speak ones mind however different from anothers point of view and a measure of its application is the ability/freedom to do so. There are holocaust and evolution deniers, multi nationals who state that their product does not have a harmful effect (Smoking, etc.,), groups who believe the British Royal Family are really Alien Lizards!! The narrow, odd, ill, or simply uninformed as to the complexity of some issues are expressing their opinions. Having the freedom to debate or speak, informs human knowledge on the individual and the group level, moving us forward to a greater understanding. There is always reality - robust data that does exist and can be accessed by millions.
Approx 12 million died in Hitlers camps. 30 million died in Stalins Gulags. Its a crime to display the swastika in many european nations but not the hammer & sickle… I think many in Poland or Latvia would see little difference between the symbols. This proposed law is very unbalanced.
Let’s all support this law. Then can we arrest Tony Blair for denying that the Darfur genocide was genocide?
Its easy and cheap for the media to portray other peoples views in a completely different manner particularly when they are hated.The president of Iran asked a few good questions that everyone should ask. Did holocaust happen? Who committed the holocaust? Who should really pay the price but who is paying the price?
Sharif, it is perfectly acceptable to have the freedom to ask the question, so long as we give the answer as much thought as we give the question. It intrigues me that the arguments so quickly deployed to justify holocaust-denial are the same as are so quickly rejected when it comes to questioning religious shibboleths. It’s a matter of consideration, compassion and respect. Personally I am afraid that this wouldnt so much be a law against Holoaust denial, it will be a law against saying things that just aren’t true! How can one be imprisoned for saying something that is plain and simply incorrect? Is there a difference between being criminally wrong on the one hand, and just plain stupid on the other? If there is, who defines that fine line? Should claiming that one mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter be criminalised too? Its a slippery slope indeed.
I think it may be a good law but I would also like to see a more inclusive law punishing anyone who speaks well of Stalin or Mao, since they were responsible for many more deaths of Human Beings than the Germans.
This Genocide Denial thing is absurd. People are allowed to think whatever they want, even if they are completely wrong. The truth will always remain no matter what anyone does or thinks. Whatever happened to freedom of press and freedom of speech, anyway? People try so hard to these days to control what everyone does and thinks sadly enough, as a supporter of free speech and freedom of press, I must back these people even though they are wrong about what they think. You can’t send them to detention camps to re-educate them, thats what the nazis and soviets did, does anyone remember? You people in the EU need to wake up a little bit.
The Holocaust did happen. It is European history, not Middle Eastern or Islamic history. Why are the Palestinians paying the price for what the Jews of Europe went through? Its no wonder why The Holocaust is a taboo subject in Europe and that there are many laws against its denail. For the first time I can recall I find myself agreeing with David Irving, if other countries wish to have such a law either from sincere belief or from some PR motive fine, but I am completely opposed to a further stripping away of long-held british norms on freedom of speech. Unfortunately I suspect that the current government are likely to let it through partly to prove their European credentials and partly because of their fanatical desire to remove every trace of British/English culture and norms. I really can’t see that the passing of such a law by the EU or individual state is going to have any impact so what ever on the Iranians so that justification is pure nonsense.
Are there not already laws against activities that are a threat to public order? And could it become a criminal offence to deny a holocaust or war crime that had not, in fact, happened?
The need to pass legislation punishing denial of genocide, crimes against humanity and war crimes is rather worrysome. Will this really make a difference to those who were at some point, directly or indirectly, involved in the commission of such crimes? There is no doubt that the idea is morally symbolic, but if they were capable of committing the crimes, no legislation can help them feel bad about it, and no legislation can help the victims feel better. I believe the European states that are keen on making it an imprisonable offence to deny genocide should properly recognise that they are passing laws on what they failed to prevent a long time ago, and learn the lesson to act on time in the future. “The Yugoslav war crimes” the expression used in the first parapraph of this diary, is somewhat a denial in itself, at least in the eyes of the Bosnia and Herzegovina citizens. Please see the August 2001 ICTY Conviction of Radislav Krstic, a Serb General in Bosnia, for the crimes of genocide.
This type of legislation is going to prove counter-productive. It’s going to polarise factions even further. Perhaps this is indeed the hidden intent of the German government. If parents favour one child over another they will be sure to to reap the results of resentment and eventual rejection by their children. In this day and age we should be thinking more in terms of reconcilliation and peace rather than provocatively, openly favouring a particular group/groups with needless new laws. Furthermore introducing new laws puts a thought in some communities’ minds which otherwise may never have occured to them. I think very few British and European Moslems truly believe the Holocaust is a myth. They’re going to wonder why governments are stirring up the issue. Incidently, my ancestors were Eastern European Jews, victims of the Pogroms. So because Iran has stated it wants to wipe Israel off the map, we need to implement a law limiting freedom of speech? If some crackpot wants to deny the holocaust took place, then they will be derided for the plonker they clearly are. However, this law has a very broad scope and clearly limits freedom of speech that should be the foundation of any decent democracy. The Terrorism Act already has limited our speech enough, we should not allow the German Presidency to push through yet more restrictions. , as EU correspondent, perhaps you could highlight how the Presidency of the EU is meant to be neutral in its position vis-a-vis regulation and is not meant to use the opportunity to push through laws it wants enacted throughout Europe. Why hasn’t anyone made anymore of such a blatant disregard for EU principles?
I find prior constraint laws pertaining to speech to be highly objectionable. This is the government’s attempt to limit what people can think. Anyone is free to think or believe what s/he wants to. The limitation is on one’s right to act on one’s beliefs. Government should not be in the business of enforcing dogma. Rather, government is the business of facilitating the peaceful coexistence of people with all points of view, no matter how ill-informed or stupid they appear to be.
i think one should be able to say what that individual thinks freely and without fear of prosecution, let me give you an example, i think george w bush is fat and ugly and he is the worst president ever, now not everyone will gree with me(at least the fat and ugly part) but it is esential that one can express whats in your mind freely, if some one wishes to deny the holocaust then so be it, if you dont agree with what that individual thinks well.. simply dont agree, come on its a basic human right FREEDOM OF SPEECH!
I am studying for a year in Germany to learn German. On Tuesday there was an anti-nazi march and I was there in the front lines. I was talking to many of the marchers, many people came and hug me and they were very courageous and angry. Yes, angry some even crying for having to march for democracy. They could not believe the ghost of ‘nazism’ was back in their country. We met the neonazi mob outside the synagoge here in Dresden and all these young people run very angry at them braking the wall of policemen. I was very proud of their courage and felt very sure that this culturally rich and beautiful country of Germany has to offer much more than Holocaust deniers.
Maybe previous comments suggest that these people should be allowed to express their opinion, or to simply ask questions about history. The problem is Holocaust Deniers are 99% of the time anti-semites, and their hatred of the Jews is what drives them to deny that the Holocaust happened. They are not simply expressing an opinion, but attempting to turn peole against Jews, and in today’s Europe where anti-semitism is on the raise, particularly in Central and Eastern Europe this is very dangerous. The internet is full of Holocaust deniers spreading their ‘theories’ about influencing minds. As time passes and Holocaust survivors pass away, it will become easier and easier for doubt to be cast on what is one of the most widely documented and evidence supported events of recent history.
I’m afraid the problem isn’t just one of free speech. When Holocaust denial was just the preserve of a few nutters, there was no problem in letting such people say what they wanted. But increasingly Holocaust denial is becoming part of a wider political agenda. To take an example from another correspondent: if I say “George Bush is a deeply stupid, arrogant and dangerous man”, then that’s my opinion and I have a right to say it. If I then carry on and say “and I demand that anyone who thinks George Bush is right and good should be herded up, forced through giant mincing machines and spread on the land as fertiliser”, then I should be stopped from promoting that idea or trying to get others to agree with me or act on that idea. And if that restricts my right to free speech, then that’s tough. Remember, didn’t Mr Spock say “the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few”? And for “needs”, substitute “rights”.
So decision making in the EU takes time, particularly if it involves a proposal from an unelected body that has to be scrutinized by elected governments. Sounds like democracy to me. What I still don’t understand is this: I drive a small BMW emitting around 140 gr/km of CO2, only 10 gr/km more than the limit they want to impose on car makers in 2012. Many other European made cars emit even less carbon! But obviously these cars don’t seem very much in demand - people don’t buy them, they want and buy bigger and stronger cars. Demand is still one of the pincipal forces in a market economy, so to me it follows that politicians should try to influence demand, rather than regulate supply. Unless we agree to discard the present market economy, based on private investments, and turn to a state controlled supply economy.
In addition, the Commission, Coreper and the Parliament will be massively lobbied = wined, dined and talked at until they turn blue, said Graham Chambers, Luxembourg. YES, particularly by the environmental lobby groups, the politically correct and government sponsored NGO’s who have hijacked DG environment. Which shows the whole undemocratic show of the unelected officials in the EU commission should be reformed swiftly and reflect political realities much more than it does now. That will also stop this morally superior howling about the ‘nasty car lobby’ = the automotive industry, good for 12 million jobs (yes, twelve million!!!!). May they also say something? It’s about their income, you know…..
A good idea to show the path of European law making. (democratically listening to each member state’s view) Please try to avoid puryeying the UK view that: a. Brussels is slow and inefficient; b. Germany’s car producers’ are responsible for serious CO2 emissions, don’t forget they still have an industry, continually investing in the development and improvment of their products , (which, by the way, seem to be the preferred ‘European car choice’ of most Brits); Most important of all: the Germans appear to take the EU and its legislation seriously, and work with it for the better.
The EU and the Governments of the EU should state clearly that in 10 years time no new vehicle can be sold which has any emissions at all.
I have worked for the European Parliament for 25 years. Of course car manufacturers will whine - they always do. But the more astute of them will already assume that the draft directive will be passed sometime around 2010 and make provisions now accordingly. In addition, the Commission, Coreper and the Parliament will be massively lobbied = wined, dined and talked at until they turn blue. The really astute lobbyists will also target the staff of the appropriate EP Committees and the staff of the Political Groups for these are the people who mostly draft the amendments as the draft directive passes through the EP.
Why legislate in a piecemeal way against CO2 emissions, such as taxes on 4×4s and airflights and incentives for windfarms. These are distractions. Surely a blanket tax on carbon fuels would be easier and far more effective.
The “closed door” discussions on EU lawmaking might seem remote and undemocratic to some. However becasue it takes a long time the legislation is more “tested” than national legislation made up “on the hoof”. Thanks Mark for your usual objective and clear reporting, now try to get it into the UK education sysllabus too! Now there’s a task!
Let’s hope the legislative process doesn’t take that long - it is a hugely important proposal, not a ‘piecemeal’ measure as Bill Young claims.
Actually, I do not understand why everyone is talking about the CO2 emissions in grams right now. You can only burn as much carbon as you pour into the tank. This whole virtually new debate is actually about the old question of fuel economy. Its focus just got shifted from oil shortage to exhaust gas “surplus”, but physically it’s the same problem! So the same answer applies, which is: Make fuel more expensive and consumers will conserve.
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Sport - Scotland 17-37 Italy
Posted on May 15, 2008
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Scotland: (10) 17 Italy: (24) 37
Scotland handed Italy their first away win in the Six Nations with a suicidal first six minutes at Murrayfield.
606 DEBATE: Give your thoughts on Scotland’s
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Interview: Scotland coach Frank Hadden